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June 26, 2009

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maddypie2

This is an absolute farce and another way to bring
America to its knees.
Global warming doesn't exist to the disastrous extent that libs want us to believe.

But if they believe it is
"global" turning green in the face from not breathing wouldn't stop or help the earth.
The whole earth would have to abide by the same restrictions to make any impact.
The countries that all of our American jobs will now be going to aren't going to have "cap&tax" they have no regulations at all.

This is about bo having power to mold and shape America they way he wants it. And for any one who is naive let me tell you, his need for power and control is not a 4 or 8 year grab.
Some one who changes the landscape,morals,values and core of America in 5 months has a commitment for life.
Yeah he's a lifer and what are we going to do about that?

Derek

Let's not go too crazy. The EU already has cap and trade. Hasn't exactly killed off their economy. Not to mention the way we stopped acid rain was by implementing cap and trade on SO2 in the 90's.

So let's turn the hysteria down just a few notches. I assume you people want to be taken SOMEWHAT seriously.

maddypie2

As usual some people should save themselves the time of posting with such
"limp" words.
New Zealand is in the process of undoing all of their cap&tax because it is an economy killer and won't likely improve any thing.

Yeah why don't you move to one of those 27 EU countries if you are so hot on them.

It isn't working any where and again I say if it isn't done world wide there is no point in doing it.

Tell the chimp to clean out your ears there is no hysteria here but it would please you if there was.
You're a moron on most issue's. Go catch up on writing another one of your useless manifesto's.
Or go take a nap and dream about the job you will never get as an air traffic controller.
Because you will never pass the mental evaluation test.

diane

Derek let me try and explain the consequence of a tax package like this.

the consumer gets a 95% tax raise. which makes the good they wish to buy more expensive. The consumer buys less goods because they are more expensive than the consumer can afford. Which sends the economy into a recession (which we are already in). Which causes people to buy less. Which causes lay-off, which causes people to have less money to buy. Which cause people to stop traveling. Which cause a hiring freeze. Which causes you not to get your air traffic controller job.

Derek

The revenue from cap and trade doesn't just disappear into thin air, it goes to tax rebates and subsidies for alt energy. So while the impact isn't neutral (this isn't the most efficient way to handle things) your analysis is foolish.

Derek

And didn't you guys all vote for a guy named Mccain who was pro-carbon tax?

SELL OUTS.

All of you... the reason conservatism is dying. Nothing but a bunch of GOP cheerleaders.

James T.

Derek the reason why YOU GUYS are in danger of committing suicide is because YOU GUYS don't care about the truth.

It's to inconvenient.

Obama calls this a jobs bill. How's the stimulus worked for Job creation? How has cap and trade worked for Spain?

Derek = Dangerous Diversion

Deal with the article, the facts... enough with your obsession with Bush and McCain.

Derek

"YOU GUYS don't care about the truth."

I brought the truth. I'm the only one that even brought up anything about cap and trade as it already exists in the world and in america.

Derek

Go ahead, get some knowledge. Stop spouting the latest wingnut meme:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union_Emission_Trading_Scheme

Derek

In addition to sulfur emissions, we also used a permit trading system to get rid of leaded gasoline. That also didn't exactly destroy our economy.

Like i said, I assume you people want to be taken SOMEWHAT seriously.

maddypie2

gnat you are the epitome of
"wing nut meme."

If you just focus on the amount of job loss that we will have in this Country with American Companies moving to other countries that alone makes this bill devastating. All the other regulations this bill contains will handicap us from ever being a viable Country.
This is nothing but a big ass pay off to those who got bo elected and like you he is too much of a moron to see the insanity of this bill.
Besides the fact is that global warming is being disproved on a daily bases by many who bought into it years ago. But now with more study and data they see the error they have made. The EPA is doing its best to keep this info. from getting out.

It is all a sham and why you would side with this leads me to believe you are anit-American. And I will keep saying it because it is true.
You're an ass backward idiot.
You are a troll.
Patrick puts you to shame. He may not agree with me but he isn't a pigheaded nut case like you.


Frank Unraveled

FACTS?

We ain't got no facts. We don't need no facts! I don't have to show you any stinkin' facts!

--maddypie2

Derek

liberal chart of the day:

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/.a/6a00d83451c45669e20115706db69b970c-popup

Patrick Austin

Oh gawd. My name has come up in a Maddy / Derek debate.

I'm not read up enough on the issue to comment. But it's 104+ degrees down here in Texas. Record temps. Don't tell me global warming isn't real!

Send ice.

James T.

Patrick? Is it global warming or is it that you live in TEXAS!!!!!

Derek

first quarter of this year is going to be one of the hottest quarters on record.

maddypie2

Who's record is that?
Summer is hot
Winter is cold
Get it?

Its all goes in a cycle.
Maybe if you live long enough like me (57)you will hold in your memory bank the cooler summers or the rainy summers or the fridged winters or the winter that had hardly any snow. Or the 62 degree Christmas Day in 1980 1981 or 1982 sorry I can't remember for sure.
Nothing is any different then it has ever been.

Gracie

"The revenue from cap and trade doesn't just disappear into thin air, it goes to tax rebates and subsidies for alt.energy".

It's likely that lots of it goes into the pockets of the well-connected (and those that knew which companies to invest in if this massive bill goes through)I guess that would still be the well-connected. It's sure not the middle-class..they are working too many darn hours just to keep up.

Happenstance

Globally, the first quarter was the 10th warmest on record (.97 F higher than average). In the US though, it was a pretty average winter (.6 F) warmer than the long term average.

http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/5/01032009dvtemprankpg.gif

A lot of places, Midwest and Northeast, set both record highs and record lows within the three month period, which is interesting in and of itself. Also in our area, we set the record for the wettest periods on record. So James, thank your snowblowers for their hard work this past winter. :)

Happenstance

I generally don't believe in man-made global warming. I would prefer, though, people to gather the information then draw conclusions. The key part is to allow access to the studies that support either way. With the apparent transparency we were told we would have, this comes out.

http://cei.org/news-release/2009/06/25/cei-releases-global-warming-study-censored-epa

This study offers a great and crucial counterpoint to the global warming debate. Usually conservatives grasp on to the economics of the global warming plans, this adds extra fuel to the fire by discrediting the science of it. I am only through page 25, but the science is astounding.

Even in recent news, more scientists are debunking the myth that is global warming. Some scientists listed are former backers of global warming now turned against the science of it. Kimberley Strassel has a nice read in the WSJ.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124597505076157449.html

In the end, we have heard plenty from the supporters of the man-made global warming movement. Now we are getting to hear a lot more from the scientists who actually believe this is faulty science resulting in a myth. It will probably be 100's to 1000's of years before anyone can really see if global warming (climate change lol) was a myth. As of right now, the science does not support it and I will not throw support behind this movement until concrete, concise evidence is offered.

As for cap and tax, talk about lose-lose for the Democrats. I really don't want to see any form of this passed. But if it does, it will only blow up in the face of Democrats who think with our failing economy only getting weaker and weaker that this will be the blow that breaks the poor camel's back. Hopefully this can be a sticking point in 2010 when a lot of the newer Democrats who voted for this see how badly the choose to support the party instead of looking at the devastation of this bill.

maddypie2

Happenstance, Thanks for posting those links.
I'm listening to Mark Levine right now and just heard Michelle Bachman from Minnesota say that the dems added a 300 hundred page amendment at 3:00am this morning that includes the whole Country will be regulated under California building coeds if this bill passes. Its like what the hell? No need for separate State Governors or any state leadership. We will be run by federal agencies. And God only knows what else is in this. No one dem or Republican has been able to read the whole bill or the amendment.
So much for transparency.
These people are being promised any thing by pelosi and bo to get their vote. They are all fools.

It has just now passed in the House 219 to 212. Eight republicans voted for it forty three dems voted against.
Mike Pence said the Republicans across the Country will take this to the people and do all in their power to make sure this legislation does not reach bo's desk. He said the White House switch board was on fire today with people calling their representatives. People are waking up and the fight is on.

Derek

What fight? Passing it through the house means the dems get to put it in their pocket and bring it out anytime between now and fall 2010. They're just going to let you wear out whatever little money you have out on it, wait until the tantrums are done then bring it out later.

Later being optimum for another reason. The EPA already has the power to regulate CO2 emissions. They don't actually need congress. And the special interests that would normally be against cap and trade are eventually going to be begging for a compromise when the heavy hand of the EPA comes down.

It's sort of like what obama is doing with healthcare. The industry can't completely oppose it because SOMETHING is going to come out of october due to the budget reconciliation process. And they'd prefer it be something they had a hand in rather then a bill that amounts to 51 dems telling everyone else to go screw themselves.

I don't know if it's being in the beltway bubble or what, but the republican leadership keeps making opposition moves that they think are good, but really that just dig their grave deeper. Whether it's Sotomayor, the budget, the stimulus... eventually you just have to realize that it's OK to forfeit. Especially if you don't have a plan or chance of winning in the first place.

Joyce

All those regulations, untold numbers of job losses, good-bye and good-night to many many American industries... for a mere .005 rise in temperature.

Hmmmm... do you suppose just maybe there's other reasons for passing the cap-tax? And Derek, please do not tell me the 4 words Pelosi used. That is the biggest lie of all fed to the robotic, idol-worshiping obamabots.

Derek

Because climate change doesn't magically have a neutral impact on the economy.

Joyce

Derek. "Because climate change doesn't magically have a neutral impact on the economy." Please explain the statement.

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