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    « German Fried Chicken - Finger Licking Racist? | Main | 60 to 0! »

    March 17, 2009

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    Derek

    The economy has been in trouble since 07. You guys wouldn't know that because you spent half your presidential primary debates arguing about doubling the size of Guantanamo, and which candidate wanted to make love to Ronald Reagan the most.

    Joyce

    Clueless

    DavidB

    What is the point of the image? The Urkle caused the economy to collapse?

    Frances

    LOVE IT!

    No David, the point of the Urkle image is his catch phrase of "did I do that?"....

    Derek, the economy hasn't been like it is now. Look at the mess he is creating for our future. He signs bailouts like its no big deal. AIG should have never gotten the help to begin with. The world would not have ended. Look at Enron, the world didn't end when that company went under did it? Nope. Now he wants to act all high and mighty about the exec's bonuses when he was spending OUR money like it nothing. Get off your high horse Obama and clean up your own house (Congress) before trying to clean up another house. God help us over the next four years.

    Derek

    "Derek, the economy hasn't been like it is now."

    Well, yeah, that would be what happens when you are 16 months in to a downturn rather then 1 month.

    " Look at Enron, the world didn't end when that company went under did it? Nope."

    This is more than just Enron. I mean, even Bush figured that out.

    DavidB

    @Frances

    "AIG should have never gotten the help to begin with."

    This comment shows a complete lack of understandingn of the banking system and mess that the entire world is in.

    I think you are right in staying in the no bailout bandwagon crowd as I am there as well however I have to break it to you that the AIG bailout is necessary to keep the entire system running. Please google search "AIG counterparties," for more information. Namely we just saved a large chunk of the European banking system.

    Your anger and frustration is misplaced at least on this point.

    DavidB

    2 Months in and you guys are already screaming that Obama is at fault and causing this economic collapse.

    Take the wheel and try to turn the titanic if you think you can do better.

    Lauren

    I actually love that Derek says since 2007 because that IS when the Democrats took over the majority in Congress and started screwing with all the laws that allowed this mess to happen. THANKS!

    Derek

    What laws?

    DavidB

    So the mess started in 07 now?!

    Please pass the cool aid...

    LegioNofZioN

    time for the voice of reason, LegioN is here again to add some. the economy is bigger than either party alone, and this is bigger than just democrats screwing up. Sure there are a number of democrats who participated in this downturn through poor decisions etc but they were not alone. Republicans have not been abiding the principles that garnered their success in the 90's.

    Obama still hasn't done much, or enough for the investing class, and the irony is that there isn't much he could do other than platitudes and optimism, which apparently Bernake is all about. It's not all Obama's fault, not yet at least. the inflation, when it hits, that will be primarily in his hands as a result of the choices he has made so far.

    LegioNofZioN

    in short lets be reasoned about this, Obama should be treated like a man, not like the right wing Bush. Even if that is how they treated Bush, WE (on the right) are better than this childish behaviour. je me souviens, is the Quebecois motto that means I remember. Fallen comrades, mistakes of the past, or the cycles and rhyming patterns of history. this is what we must do. Remember the irratational treatment conservatives and Bush got from the left, and don't mimick it. rise above, and keep the context to the matter we are discussing.

    If the current situation between right and left were to play out inverted many of you would be saying the same crap as Derek and to a lesser degree DavidB. I'm not saying you can't criticize, just try to keep it factually based on what you happen to know enough about. I'm not 30 yet, nor an American and I can see that the current issues, although compounded by Obama, start earlier than his influence.

    Just something to think about.

    James T.

    Legion,
    Stop being a Killjoy! :-)

    Frances

    I know the industry of AIG, I work a competitor. We handled our money just fine and we didn't need a bailout. We would have GLADLY taken on AIG business.

    Letting AIG fall would not have made the world end dear....sorry to have to break that news to you.

    Frances

    I really do try and keep my comments as fact based as I can. I also go by my life experience. Life experience tells me that we are in a sorry place right now.

    As for all the taxpayers yelling about why the execs of AIG got their contractually obligated bonuses. You are yelling too damn late. You should have been yelling when they gave AIG YOUR money to begin with. AIG got your money without taxpayers getting a second thought.

    Diana

    Its Kool Aid. And its grape! Sing with me kids.

    DavidB

    Well put Legion!

    Frances you sure don't seem to know what your talking about for someone who works at a competitor of AIG.

    You can't just transfer the business to another company. Whatever company you work for is not large enough to handle the AIG obligations even if you could transfer them.

    The reason we are bailing out AIG is because if we didn't Goldman Sacks JP Morgan and about a dozen European banks would be in a world of hurt if we didn't. Again do a google search for "AIG counterparties"

    If you really want to fix the problem then stop letting companies get large enough to be "to big to fail."

    James T.

    DavidB,
    I agree about letting banks or anybody else get "to big to fail," however I think Frances is right! If AIG went down, there would be plenty of other smaller companies there to buy in. Any body in a would of hurt (the big boys) probably deserved to be there.

    Patrick Austin

    Based on what I've seen these companies do with the bailout money, I'm agreeing with James here.

    The only way we can get these companies to tighten their belts to the degree in which they need to be tightened is to let them stare death in the face. No lifelines. They are being abused.

    However James, you are still wrong for the Urkel pic!

    David Shuman

    American Reinvestment Act
    It all began when the government mandated banks to lower their standards for loans - housing, cars, credit cards, etc.
    And who signed the American Reinvestment Act into law? Jimmy Carter

    It just got worse after that, as the dems made "improvements"

    thebigshmoog

    The Urkle pic represents the fact that every time Pres. Obama steps up to the podium since Jan. 20, the Stock Market has dropped. Yes, this is the whole "stock market is just a poll" argument, but it is a valid argument - if you remember that it is a confidence poll of the free market and business to post profits and pay dividends. If the economic climate is such that business simply cannot profit, or has little chance, the value of the stocks drop as people try to dump them on the market. Poor leadership and decision making from the Federal Government- in the form of tax hikes, cap-and-trade, and the like drive the stock market as much as any other factor. Everytime PresBO has spoken on the economy, the Market has responded in kind by dropping.
    Yes, there are a lot of other factors leading to this, and lots of set-up that has resulted in the mess we are in now...but the lack of leadership from the White House is not creating an environment that most business feel will be beneficial to them to post the profit margins that they have.

    thebigshmoog

    and as far as AIG... the bonuses represent one-tenth of one percent of the bailout money given to AIG. (that we know of)... what has happened to the other 99.9%???? It's spent and gone, unfortunately, and the vast majority has gone to overseas companies. But this is what happens when we try to solve problems in the middle of the crisis. We jump into the lake, with out checking the depth. This time, we found the rock 2 feet below the surface... Never waste a good crisis! Bold and Swift! ...whatever happened to sit back, take a day, read it through, figure out all the positives and negatives, then make the decision? OH, if we did that, we would have never agreed to letting our hard earned money get taken from us and given to companies like AIG. Why cram these spending packages through Congress? Same reason...

    Derek

    "

    American Reinvestment Act
    It all began when the government mandated banks to lower their standards for loans - housing, cars, credit cards, etc.
    And who signed the American Reinvestment Act into law? Jimmy Carter

    It just got worse after that, as the dems made "improvements"
    "

    I mean I can say that the subprime industry wasn't regulated by the CRA until i'm blue in the face, but what kills me is that no one even attempts to just look at common sense.

    A law during the carter admin led to an exponential increase in home prices 30 YEARS LATER?

    Brilliant conclusion. Sean Hannity would be proud.

    Derek

    " If AIG went down, there would be plenty of other smaller companies there to buy in"

    But the thing is, if you're wrong, then we have a trillion dollars in uninsured capital out there. No one would trust any bank anymore. And just how many companies out there have enough money to take on that much risk? If the largest insurance company in the world couldn't do it, then who can?

    Frances

    Ok Derek, you are the one now that seems to not know what you are talking about. There are thousands of insurance/financial companies out there that can take over AIG business with no problems. My company being one. I won't say the name of the company I work for, but lets just say we are no small mom and pop company. Our name is very well known. AIG isn't the only company that works overseas either. We have locations all over the world. We take over business on a daily basis. I have seen MANY MANY AIG cases come across my desk because their clients are jumping ship. No matter how many bail outs they get, if their clients jump ship they are nobody...and guess what, we are the ones with the life boats.

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