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    « Have You Seen This? | Main | Now let us pause to recognizing the true meaning of earth day. »

    April 21, 2008


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    Michael Mathias

    Well, I can certainly understand his cynicism. At nine, he's only been around for the administration of George W. Bush--and he's a proven liar and, quite possibly, a war criminal.

    Independant American

    Dayum! That was some powerful stuff Michael. James how can you explain GWB to your children? If birds of a feather do in fact flock together, how can you explain your reasoning for voting for GWB? I'm not attacking you I'm just wondering. That's gotta be up there with the birds and the bees talk.

    James T

    Cynicism? Come now, Michael, why must you assume? The boy is nine! He just heard the words of a compromising pacifist and recognized it for what it was... weak. No cynicism whatsoever.

    I really wish the left would stop it with the war crimes stuff. How many mass graves did they find in Iraq for God's sake! Who was the mass murdering bastard who committed crimes against humanity? GWB? Please!

    Independent American,

    How do I explain GWB to my children? What's there to explain? He is who he is, a good President who turned out to be a compassionate moderate.


    Here's a good question. How do lefties explain Al Gore? Hillary Clinton? Barack Obama? Jimmy Carter?!?!?

    I'm a conservative, I thought GWB was one, too...oops! Oh well, I won't make that mistake again.

    At least we got some GREAT Supreme Court judges out of him. Ha!

    What what will you lefties do when GWB is out of office? Will you continue to whine, bitch and moan (for decades) like you did with Reagan?


    Well when people are awful leaders, you have to remind people, who think that GWB and Reagan are great, that they are in fact war criminals and human monsters of unimaginable terror. That goes for the DLC as well(Bill and Hil).

    James T

    "Human monsters of unimaginable terror".


    Only in America and on the left can such stupid things be said in seriousness.

    A few posts back I took heat for equating the NAACP to the Nazis. I was referring to their like minded ideology. Now here you go equating two American Presidents to war crimes and unimaginable terror...Why? Were you part of
    Saddam's Republican Guard? Were you a member of Al-Qaeda?

    Probably not.

    When denigrating Republican Presidents, why must the left use the same terminology as America's enemies?

    Michael Mathias

    "Will you continue to whine, bitch and moan (for decades) like you did with Reagan?"

    Well, James, you're still complaining about Carter--and all he did was secure a peace treaty between Egypt and Israel, win a Nobel prize, work for Habitat for Humanity, and earn an international reputation for his work at the Carter Center, which promotes peace and justice and fair elections around the world. George W. Bush has a lot to do to catch up to that kind of production.

    As for how long, I'll be complaining, let me put it this way: you and I have our nine-year olds to hug and to hold, and to engage in conversations about politics. Many tens of thousands of parents have been robbed of that opportunity because Bush sent soldiers in to drop bombs on their neighborhoods. Similarly, many tens of thousands of children are growing up without their parents for the same reason. People are dead there for no reason at all. I think that's worth complaining about.

    (And people wonder why conservatives are accused of a lack of compassion.)

    James T

    Lack of compassion? What about the tens of thousands of families that Saddam Hussein slaughtered? What about the hundreds of thousands murdered?

    Have you no compassion for them? Michael? Have you no compassion for the millions of people who are now free of a murderous dictator?

    Because of the actions of GWB there are thousands of parents who now have the freedom to discuss politics, worship God and have a life.

    Jimmy Carter, sigh. I tire of this. You are willfully blind. You have a hard-on for failure. Dude! Reagan is dead and yet you still whine! Carter is alive and still screwing up!

    You speak about Nobel prizes and peace treaties that have obviously failed and brought more war. If Carter is such a great peacemaker how come he is is always hauling ass to the middle east?


    All you do is talk about peace, peace where there is no peace.

    The people of Iraq and Afghanistan have more peace because of GWB than the people of Iran have because of Carter!

    Uncle Ed

    WOW! This was the kind of discussion that we enjoy on this blog. OK, so both the left and the right have concerns, issues, anger, misunderstandings, finger pointing, and in general different approaches to the solution to the problem. I get it! Here is the question that I have never heard an answer to from our friends on the left; what would you have done after the most significant buildings in our most significant city were attacked killing thousands of civilians, American civilians. I'm not asking for conspiracy theories, just what would you have done?

    Michael Mathias

    Well, Uncle Ed (if that's your real name), I certainly would not have invaded Iraq since no one there was responsible for 9/11. Or maybe you thought that just shooting any Muslim was the right response?

    James--The treaty Carter negotiated was between Israel and Egypt. (I'm not sure what you mean by Iran.) I'm uwaware of any recent war between these two countries, but do let me know if I missed it. But, more importantly, I find no justification in killing Iraqi children just becuase Saddam Hussein did too. I have higher standards for how the US should act than that.

    Uncle Ed

    MM, Passing on the opportunity to respond to you unsubstantiated and inflammatory statements, I return to my question; what would you have done?


    Well James, who gave Saddam his weapons? What nation's logo was on the gas canisters that he used in Iran and Kurdistan. Who gave training to future members of Al Qeada, as well as money? But you don't only want me to talk about the GOP, fine... Carter broke a promise he mad to the new leaders of Iran, not to let the Shah into the United States. (Oddly enough, It was the Shah and the fundamentalists that we help overthrow the elected leader of Iran in 1957.) Thus, the raid on the embassy. He turned a blind eye to terrorists in South America, because we were paying them. But he has been a great ex-president. Clinton? Got involved in a Civil War in Serbia and killed thousands with NATO, forgot that Rwanda was important, let that genocide happen. As far as 9/11, maybe we should have let the CIA and the Army Rangers into the mountains of Tora Bora to find Bin Laden (Apparently, the CIA knew EXACTLY where he was for 3 weeks and did nothing).

    James T

    Wow... That was a good volley. Nicely done. I have no response to this... yet. The day is yours.

    Michael Mathias

    Uncle--Unsubstantiated? How? Inflammatory? Civilians are not dying in a war we didn't need to fight? Please explain.

    As to your question of what would I have done following 9/11?...the very premise of your question is false. Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11.

    Independant American

    GWB a good president? JTH let go! Just admit it Bush is a bumbling idiot. His agenda is not for all Americans. He totally effed up this war in Iraq. If he had a pair he would have taken accountability for this debacle. I am not a lefty, or a liberal but a realist. Should we bring freedom and liberty to all opprssed peoples? That is the weakest scapegoat for this war. First it was weapons of mass destruction and the supposed link to Al-Queda. Then it turned into Iraqi freedom. Is that American? Get off the boat while you can.


    Jimmy Carter . . . the worst ex-president in American history.

    Well .....James T....assuming you are correct ....he better enjoy the title while he can because in almost exaclty nine months the title goes to a new champion!

    James T


    What... Just by becoming an ex will make GWB the worst ex-president ever?

    Holy stacked deck Batman!

    Is being a liberal synonymous with being blinded by hate?

    Zach W.

    "The people of Iraq and Afghanistan have more peace because of GWB than the people of Iran have because of Carter!"

    James, do you really believe those same tired talking points that we've heard time and time again from you and your ilk on the right? Don't you get tired of regurgitating the same song and dance about all that "peace" that we brought to Iraq?

    James, take a gander at those three links and then talk to me about all the "peace" the folks in Iraq are enjoying.


    it may not be stable yet, but Iraqis don't want a US withdrawl until their security forces can pick up the slack, and they are not there yet. but in context, James is completely right, in that the Ayatollah who succeeded the Shah, brought war with Iraq to Iran, and closed off one of the oldest and proudest civilizations to their past. Iran has suffered in many ways since the fall of the Shah over decades, far more than Iraq has in a few years.


    the Us has made myriad mistakes in foreign policy over the years, but it is never as simple as right or wrong. the world is far more complex than simple single sentence talking points. The US missed the first 2 years of World War 2, abandonned the pro democracy side of vietnam, installed the shah in Iran, and withdrew support for him when he became unpopular, not to mention support for Iraq against Iran during their war. My biggest issue, at least in terms of the middle east is not whose side the US picked, or how the US supported their friendlies but that the US is completely unreliable. Alliances are broken, friends tossed aside for political reasons back home, and now who can truly trust America, knowing its history of backstabbing its friends ?
    America must asssist Iraq to become stable and self reliant, or it will repeat its own mistakes etched in the anals of history, forever the turncoat

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